So I have been thinking about what to write all day and yesterday. I have been having a lot going on in my head and I can’t make much sense of it. I think I will start with tonight and work backwards.
My wife went to bed two hours ago in tears. I watched her go to lay with my son who was scared of the thunderstorms. Why was she crying? She feels torn between putting my needs before my sons. I understand why she was upset. We were trying to have a real conversation for the first time in days. She told me that she freaked out on Friday when she came home and found me slumped over my computer and having a horrible day. She knew that something had happened and she was scared that the OW and I had made contact.
So what did she do? First, she went to the OW’s Facebook. She has created a fame account so she can check up on her. I think this is her third one. Nothing was there. So then she asked me I told her I was just having a bad day. My post I was writing vanished when my computer updated without telling me. I was having a big fight with my soon to be ex-boss and I had a lot going on with my head. I had two counseling sessions the two days previous that I don’t think were helpful. So yea, I was not have a good day.
She believed there was something else and obviously did not trust that I was telling her the truth (I don’t blame her for this) so she did something she said she would not do. She looked up my blog and read it. She has told me that she would not read it so I had a safe place to put my thoughts and feelings without worrying about if she saw them. Then she thought I might be more honest with myself. I will point out that I have told her she is welcome to read it whenever she wants. I don’t think she will because some details are more than she wants to know. But I have not hid this from her.
How do I feel about it? I am not sure yet. I do need a place where I can express myself freely, but that is hard because as you will later find out that is how she found out all of the story. After all the shock and fighting about what was in my journal, she felt horribly guilty for invading my privacy. Taking away the only outlet I had left. That was in January. I was finally convinced to start writing again and I moved on to here. So again I have no safe outlet. Why do I feel I need one? Well growing up as I did I had very little privacy and very few things that I could keep to myself. So what little privacy I can get I try and protect and hide from the world. If my family found out anything they would use it against me so I learned to be extremely secretive. So now I no longer have that. She think she lost my trust after the first time because she read my personal thoughts. Yet, she went and did it again. I understand why and am not angry, but I may be more guarded than I would like. Which really in the end defeats the purpose of this blog.
She gave me a letter she wrote a while ago to the OW. I read it with no emotion on purpose. Some of the things hurt, rightly so, but I did understand her points. She did say thank you for waking us up to our problems and now maybe we can get back on track and save ourselves. And STAY OUT OF OUR LIVES…(I thought that part was funny. Perfect, but funny. Not sure why, probably inappropriate, but I did).
Step back a few hours and I have pretty much healed from my neck/shoulder injury. So I think we were both happy because now it will be the first summer in two years I won’t be injured. So I play on a local men’s league team and we played our “rivals” (Can you really still have rivals at our age?). When I am healthy I average about 3 goals a game so they wanted me to come out and play. I decided to do it so I could release some energy. I could run off all that has been building inside of me. I mentioned two years ago I tore my hamstring that out me out for 6 months and last year I broke my leg playing so it has really be a few years since I got to play on a regular basis. I was playing and about 35 min in I am running and decide to go just a bit faster to beat a guy to the ball and wham-o. I tore my other hamstring. Out I go for year 3. I hope not but it is not looking good.
I am just doing awesome right now (remember all the dripping sarcasm I throw out). We are not doing good. We are back to the same. She even said it tonight. She does not believe I will stay because love just isn’t enough for me. I don’t even know what that means. Here is what I do know. Last Friday we had a fight. I mentioned it on her, but in the end we had sex and fell asleep in each others arms. That was the last time we have been intimate. We haven’t even came close since then. I might as well live on another continent. She told the counselor that it was because it makes me sick when we do it. Well yes, it does. But it is not like I am gagging or have disgusted looks on my face. I enjoy it and show it. It isn’t until after that I get sick. I want to throw-up because I blame sex for part of this affair and a lot of our relational issues. So now it is a trigger. How do I get rid of that trigger everyone? Also I will not instigate sex. I did for 20 years and I don’t think I can take that type of rejection anymore. It is one of the worst feeling you can get, when you spouse tells you no constantly “I am too tired, or maybe tomorrow, or I haven’t showered” I would rather just not try because then I don’t get rejected. What is another 10 years? I know how this
It sucks because now I am no longer getting any attention and life is going right back where it came from. SO is love enough? Is it for anyone? Love maybe enough but I think that you have to work on that love everyday or it quickly becomes platonic. I feel she has stopped trying. She has not gone to her counselor for the last two sessions. We stopped having sex. We are not having nightly conversations anymore. And then she tells me that I don’t think love is enough for me. I think the right kind of love would be right for me. Just not the “oh, he knows I love him so I don’t need to do anything anymore type of love.’
I don’t know what to do. What she is right about it that I am struggling picturing this working out. We went shopping yesterday for a nightgown. Why? I said something stupid a month or so ago about one she was wearing about how ugly it was. So she threw it away. Now we would go through store after store and after she anything I did not find them the least but attractive. We just have such starkly different views on it. I wanted something cute, but I knew she wanted to be able to walk around with the kids and not feel uncomfortable. I stopped even suggesting because I never was close, but everything she picked was something her grandma might still wear. It was just a frustrating last few days.
So what now? How the hell do I know? I have no counseling for two weeks and I don’t know exactly how I am going to handle it. Can I use this to vent? Not anymore. So I am lost again. I feel like I am just going backwards. Everyone says it will be a roller coaster ride. I am just looking forward to get it going up again.
They say I’m old-fashioned, and live in the past, but sometimes I think progress progresses too fast! – Dr. Seuss
Surviving the affair....the cheaters perspective 
You, and she, are REALLY too focused on you feeling safe and comfortable.
Love is being selfless. Doing – and not just doing the motions but feeling drawn to do them – what is best for the person you love.
The whole problem is that you are not connecting with her because you’re letting it out HERE. It’s USELESS to your marriage, if your wife doesn’t know just as much. If you aren’t letting her in to the extent that she has to dig (which is YOUR fault, not hers) to find out what’s inside your head, then you can’t expect her to trust you with her thoughts and emotions. You’ve already proven that you didn’t/don’t take *care* of her vulnerabilities… so why should she be the one to initiate opening up?
And this next part is just an observation:
You grandstand yourself on this blog. You cannot seem to let go of the good things you have DONE but did not mean, as if the Good Things are the counterweight to ONE, SINGLE [series of] Infidelity. “I did this one bad thing but I’m a good person otherwise… see?!!” No- you are not that person. A good person means the good they do; I think you do it to avoid criticism. You fulfill many obligations and enjoy the pride of it but I don’t think you MEAN it.
You are not owed privacy; you’ve proven that you are not trustworthy.
You are not owed respect; you’ve betrayed your wife in one of the deepest ways possible.
You are not owed reciprocal attention; because while you SHOW it, she surely feels that you don’t MEAN it. She cannot reciprocate what she sees as false feeling. This is not a competition. She wants the raw truth, always, and all of it.
If you desired her… if you felt overwhelmingly drawn to her… if you NEEDED to love on her, you simply WOULD. And she knows that. Every time you do not, she knows that you don’t want her ENOUGH. Instead, you’re acting like she owes you initiation. I can’t even wrap my mind around this entirely… why on earth would you think that you deserve that?
For all the Good Things you do (because NOT doing them would have negative results), that make you feel you’re owed something, think about this… from your wife’s perspective: Is what you do unique to you and you only? Is there not another man who could fulfill those obligations? Of course- there are many. All right – so now you’re on an even playing field. Except that there are men who would MEAN it… because they love. They know that betrayal is the opposite of love. If there is betrayal, there is no love. You betrayed her completely.
Perhaps you thought – and think now – that you love your wife.
She knows you don’t. (No matter what she says… this is the little nugget of fear, deep inside, that Betrayed Spouses cover up with “I KNOW he loves me. I KNOW he’s trying. See? He did this/that. There was that soft touch last Thursday! He really does!”)
So truly – why do you think she should put one sliver more of herself into a marriage with a man who does not love her? She’s already coping with the travesty that you never did. (Because if you did, you COULD not have done this. It would be impossible.)
She has Fear [that you created] holding back the love she has for you.
You withhold the expressions of What You Think Love Is.
I don’t understand how you think that she is failing in any way. You did this. You need to face these consequences, fully, and decide if you’re willing to go through it and LOVE her or not. She’s waiting for YOU, not the other way around.
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So I needed to break down your comment to respond adequately to it.
You, and she, are REALLY too focused on you feeling safe and comfortable.
Love is being selfless. Doing – and not just doing the motions but feeling drawn to do them – what is best for the person you love.
We are focused on making me feel safe, but it does not mean that we are not focused on her either. I spend a tremendous amount of time making sure she is doing well before I ever look at myself. However, we both know that neither of us will open up if we do not feel safe and comfortable with each other and us as a couple.
The whole problem is that you are not connecting with her because you’re letting it out HERE. It’s USELESS to your marriage, if your wife doesn’t know just as much. If you aren’t letting her in to the extent that she has to dig (which is YOUR fault, not hers) to find out what’s inside your head, then you can’t expect her to trust you with her thoughts and emotions. You’ve already proven that you didn’t/don’t take *care* of her vulnerabilities… so why should she be the one to initiate opening up?
I do not hide any of this from my wife and 90%of this is discussed with her either prior to or after I post it. The 10% she does not know is because she does not want to know. It is her choice. This is just some of the details of the affair, not major parts of our story. If you notice in what I wrote, she did ask me first but she still thought there was more to it. I think she has to dig to appease her own lack of trust which I completely understand. As for having to initiate opening up…I am not sure what you mean. We do talk all the time. Sometimes they are useful sometimes they aren’t. Sometimes I initiate it and sometimes she does. It all depends on who needs to know something or is feeling a certain way.
And this next part is just an observation:
You grandstand yourself on this blog. You cannot seem to let go of the good things you have DONE but did not mean, as if the Good Things are the counterweight to ONE, SINGLE [series of] Infidelity. “I did this one bad thing but I’m a good person otherwise… see?!!” No- you are not that person. A good person means the good they do; I think you do it to avoid criticism. You fulfill many obligations and enjoy the pride of it but I don’t think you MEAN it.
I guess I did not know that I was grandstanding myself and making me look like such great person who just made a silly mistake. I don’t think that at all. I cannot seem to let go of the good things I have done. I am not sure how you get this but I can tell you that you have no idea what I am in real life and if I do a lot of good that you do not know about, because I don’t write about it. I do not like to write about it very much so I often use the same examples because they are already out there. Am I trying to balance the good and bad that I do? I sure hope not. I would have to spend so much time adding up both sides every day that I would never get anything done. As for me meaning to do good because I think I need the balance versus just doing it because I am a good person. I do it because I enjoy the good in my life. I had very little early on so when I can enjoy it I do. I don’t care if it is helping my wife shovel an old man’s driveway, even though it was not my idea. I just want to be in positive environments rather than negative ones. Now do I hope that people on here think I am a good person, yea, a little bit. I would be lying to say otherwise, but it won’t change much if people don’t think I am a good person. I am trying to change who I am for myself, my wife and my family. I am not trying to live up to the perceived expectations of people on this blog. I am fine with criticism. I am fine with this comment you wrote because it makes me self-reflect and look at the intentions of my actions. These things help me grow and learn about myself, something I desperately need.
You are not owed privacy; you’ve proven that you are not trustworthy.
You are not owed respect; you’ve betrayed your wife in one of the deepest ways possible.
You are not owed reciprocal attention; because while you SHOW it, she surely feels that you don’t MEAN it. She cannot reciprocate what she sees as false feeling. This is not a competition. She wants the raw truth, always, and all of it.
I am owed privacy, everyone is. It is what keeps us individual in group settings or a marriage. I am not asking that I get to hide things or not give her a way to check on my actions. That is not what I am asking for. I am asking for a place to organize my thoughts so I can talk them through with her or a place I can write down my feelings of a discussion we had so I can revisit them later and see if I feel the same way. Or it may be a place I can revisit what made me do what I did. Why did I do it? However, if she ever wants to know something then all she has to do is ask. I do not try to hide things from her, just like this blog. I told her she can read it if she needs to. How else do you think she even knew where to look? My point was that she said she wouldn’t and then she did. I am not angry at her, nor hurt. Really it just made understand that this place may not be 100% what I need. I like what another commenter put about using private posts. That may be the way I go for some things. The other part of this blog is it was a recommendation by my therapist and our couples therapist. Why? Because I have no one in my life. As for respect and reciprocal attention, you may have that wrong. We had problems in our marriage before I had the affair. We still have problems. If we don’t work on those problems, both from her end and mine, then there is no reason to continue being married. The idea is that hopefully we can get better, be better, and move forward. That cannot happen if one person, regardless who they are, is not respected and is ignored. Do I have to work to build the amount of respect that I lost from my wife? Yes, I know that. Do I try and give her more attention that I get? Yes, it is just different because our needs are different. She needed more of one thing while I needed more of something else. And are these feelings false? Not at all, for me they are just confusing. So I often step back and process. I may seem like I have all these feelings and emotions on here but that is not my real life, except with my wife. She is the only one who sees that side. Even the OW did not see what my wife gets to see, has seen, and will see. And I agree she wants the truth I do not intentionally hide anything. I may not be ready to share it, because I don’t understand it, but I am not hiding anything.
If you desired her… if you felt overwhelmingly drawn to her… if you NEEDED to love on her, you simply WOULD. And she knows that. Every time you do not, she knows that you don’t want her ENOUGH. Instead, you’re acting like she owes you initiation. I can’t even wrap my mind around this entirely… why on earth would you think that you deserve that?
I don’t think you understand one of the original problems in our marriage. I did desire her, I still do. I want her every day. If you are talking sex, I could have sex with her 4-5 times a day if she wanted to, possibly more. I have always felt this way about her. The problem is that for years and I am talking 10 plus years she did not return those feelings. I cannot just turn off the repercussions to that continued rejection. I cannot magically think “Oh, I really want her today so I am going to go get her.” Without the knowledge of the rejection that will come along with it. The fact that as soon as I try it will end up in a fight that will leave both of us hurt, feeling guilty, and hating what we did to the other person. Still in the end, we probably would not have sex. I do need her, but I also need her to need me because I cannot take that rejection. I cannot from where I am at today. Psychologically, I cannot handle that again. Does she know this? Yes. It is not something that we don’t discuss. As for me deserving it, well, maybe I don’t but she also may not be in a position for her to handle having sex with me again. How would I know without me risking rejection and then hurting her, making her feel guilty and damaging anything we have got going so far?
For all the Good Things you do (because NOT doing them would have negative results), that make you feel you’re owed something, think about this… from your wife’s perspective: Is what you do unique to you and you only? Is there not another man who could fulfill those obligations? Of course- there are many. All right – so now you’re on an even playing field. Except that there are men who would MEAN it… because they love. They know that betrayal is the opposite of love. If there is betrayal, there is no love. You betrayed her completely.
I agree with you. She is under no obligation to stay. There are a number of guys that she could choose from that are probably better than me. They won’t cheat on her, they won’t hurt her like I did. They may provide for her better than I can. I have told her this. If she chooses to go I would understand. However, you insinuating that I do not love my wife is not correct. Not even close.
Perhaps you thought – and think now – that you love your wife.
She knows you don’t. (No matter what she says… this is the little nugget of fear, deep inside, that Betrayed Spouses cover up with “I KNOW he loves me. I KNOW he’s trying. See? He did this/that. There was that soft touch last Thursday! He really does!”)
So truly – why do you think she should put one sliver more of herself into a marriage with a man who does not love her? She’s already coping with the travesty that you never did. (Because if you did, you COULD not have done this. It would be impossible.)
She has Fear [that you created] holding back the love she has for you.
You withhold the expressions of What You Think Love Is.
I don’t understand how you think that she is failing in any way. You did this. You need to face these consequences, fully, and decide if you’re willing to go through it and LOVE her or not. She’s waiting for YOU, not the other way around.
I understand what you are saying with all of this. If I loved her I would make sure she had all her needs met and that I showered her with love and attention to show her that I love her. I need to show that I am not scarred from this, so I can help her through all of this. Do I think she is failing? No, but I also know that she believes that she is because of those things I listed.
Now I am more than willing to face the consequences. It is never something that I have shied away from. I am more than willing to go through whatever it is that I need to go through if I know in the end there is hope. I am not asking for a guarantee, just hope.
Hopefully I addressed everything in your comment. If you want to follow up feel free to comment back. I don’t know how everyone else is reacting to this post. Once I got your comment I pasted it in word and am slowly working on it while I am at work. I am glad that you shared this opinion with me. Whether you want to believe it or not it helps me because it helps me understand things myself and also allows me to have a wider perspective when I talk with my wife. I am sure people will think that you hate me and you just may, but I also can understand why.
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I don’t hate you… I think you are unaware of how deeply you’ve hurt her and continue to hurt her. Of how deep into your marriage – and primarily, into each of you – this goes. Of how much more awful you’re going to feel about yourself, if this gets anywhere near how deep you’ll need it to, to fix this. I think you’re unaware of how wonderful it is to know that someone who knows EVERYTHING about you loves you STILL.
You’ve done great things in life, from where you’ve come. But ALL of that? Is simply meeting the standards of what was promised, by you to her, in your vows. Promises you made with the guise of being a “normal” person. You had to work HARD to get to that level of normalcy. It feels like an accomplishment, to be a father and have a family without the effed-up issues you grew up with.
But it’s still just standard. Regularly good. What you SHOULD do.
Many, myself included, have had a messed-up adolescence, to say the least. I have dealt with and overcome Some Serious Shit.
I do not expect my husband to be overly grateful that I show him love, keep our home clean, cook, and keep our children safe, loved, and educated… because I SHOULD do those things. It has actually taken monumental effort to maintain this standard, which I’m sure you can relate to as well. I do NOT, however, throw this in his face. Or when I fail, use it as an excuse (sorry, an “explanation” that sounds an awful lot like an excuse.) I don’t beat our children. I don’t shy away from their affection. I don’t disown friends and family who even slightly point out that something I’m doing is perhaps not a Good Thing. I don’t make them participate in activities to show other parents what a Great Parent I am. I stayed home primarily so that there was ZERO chance of them being molested. To this day, I’ve never been away from our children for longer than 12 hours (mostly when sleeping at Grandma’s, and there are no men present at all.) It’s not nice or normal to feel a 15 year-old boy trying to rape you every day – trying to shove his dick into you and clenching him out with all the strength in your body. It’s not nice or normal to be dragged around the house by your ponytail, to the spot where you missed doing a chore PERFECTLY. And being beaten once you arrive at that spot, then beaten more for crying so loudly.
This monumental effort, to meet the most basic standards, is not brought up. What I do, over and above that? That IS. Cheating would not qualify as over and above… it would sink lower. Into a different plane, no doubt, but still WELL below standard.
I guess my biggest issue, when reading your posts, is that you feel you’re owed credit for being a decent, regular husband. You have one paragraph of a way you’ve done wrong (but not explaining ALL of it) and FAR more paragraphs to show that you’re a good person… like you’re trying to convince yourself through outside praise.
Bac- you’re better than your parents. You’re THERE and surpassed them long ago. Awesome!
You can do better than JUST that. You could have paid child support and never seen your children and done better than your parents. You could have dropped them off at the fire department and done better than your parents. ALL you’ve done – while it’s great – is meet the standard expectation of a Decent Father. You show up. You take care of them. You do stuff. Awesome! But not extra-Ordinary.
You can OPEN yourself to Love now, and go further, even if you think it’s stupid to be so vulnerable. You never have been so vulnerable and I can see a man scoffing at that while a woman in the same position would just be very, very afraid. You don’t have Love now. Not for anyone. You just don’t. You could not even THINK that contacting the OW was an option, if you did. But you CAN open up THAT much… and it’s going to be terrifying at first. For a while after that too. And when your wife knows ALL of the ugliness? What you REALLY think, even if you DO something in the opposite manner? And loves you anyway? That’s where the comfort STARTS. THAT’s when you realize that you ARE actually safe. Give her more credit than what you have… if she didn’t love you – LOVE you – that much? She wouldn’t be there still. Truly.
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As to the topic of privacy- I have none. W has none, unless he hides it from me. He has always been given the password to everything. We have three passwords we’ve used for the past 12 years, unless he has hidden it from me. I consider my husband an integral part of myself. I always assumed it was the same for him… that is the COMFORT of marriage. The SAFETY. In knowing that comforting each other comforts ourselves because we’re as concerned for each other as much or more than we’re concerned for ourselves. We’re on the same team, no matter the ugliness and weaknesses in the past and present; we know that we’ll resolve and move UPWARD from it – that’s what marriage is. It was incomplete, before.
You have not been completely vulnerable with her, and that’s what is NECESSARY to feel truly safe… but that isn’t her fault. She cannot know what you don’t share with her. Perhaps she has not been COMPLETELY vulnerable with you either. It IS scary. But you NEED to go first, because of betraying even what she did offer. Any moment you’re thinking “What she doesn’t understand is that…,” that’s when you tell HER. You tell her. You cry. You tremble in fear she’ll reject you. It’s what should have happened before you even got married. To share with someone COMPLETELY, and know they love you anyway. That’s when you get married.
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You wrote:
I stayed home primarily so that there was ZERO chance of them being molested. To this day, I’ve never been away from our children for longer than 12 hours (mostly when sleeping at Grandma’s, and there are no men present at all.) It’s not nice or normal to feel a 15 year-old boy trying to rape you every day – trying to shove his dick into you and clenching him out with all the strength in your body. It’s not nice or normal to be dragged around the house by your ponytail, to the spot where you missed doing a chore PERFECTLY. And being beaten once you arrive at that spot, then beaten more for crying so loudly.
Seriously, I don’t think you know how similar we are. I am very familiar to what you are describing. Slightly different but not much.
I am glad you have overcame it. Also this response really helped me in talking to my wife. I talked to her about me thinking that me getting to normal was great, when in reality it is just that NORMAL. I need to do a bit better. While I don’t think she agreed fully, she understood and is willing to help me be better for/with her and our kids.
Thank you!
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I think the point you’re trying to make is that there is a huge difference between platonic love and passionate love. Every marriage needs a great deal of passion. I’m not just saying passion in the bedroom, but passion in life! It sounds lime you’ve both lost passion for anything, everything!?
Also, the privacy thing is huge, start locking certain blogs or poems, or what not. You can do that here on WordPress.
Remember, if you want change…YOU have to be the change!
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I completely agree about the passion and thanks for the other suggestions.
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Are you mad at your wife for reading your journal and finding out about the affair?
I know when someone reads your private thoughts it feels like an intrusion. But can you really blame her for before and for this time? I think you should be honest with her, sit her down and tell her “if you go onto my blog you most probably won’t like what you read. It is me in the raw. My feelings of before and during the affair are out there for me to comprehend and understand how I got there. You can ask me, I would tell you, but it will still hurt reading it. My feelings, and doubts of today are out there too and I can tell you but reading Will hurt you too.” I don’t think you should stop writing just because she had the need to read this time. I think you two should be honest with each other regarding what you both want out of the Marriage.
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I am not angry at her for reading it. I told her upfront she can read it. She just said she did not want to and then did it to see if something happened that I am not telling her. Do I blame her for it? Not in the least. I just am not sure what to think of feel about it yet.
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Don’t let it discourage you in writing down your thoughts, feelings and history. If It’s helping you than don’t give up on this outlet. As always just be honest and upfront with your wife. Tell her you need this and you understand her coming here to get answers she thinks she’s not getting from you. But to talk to you first about it.
I found a few picture quotes the other day, they are uplifting and reminded me of your situation. I’ll send them to you if you like.
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Absolutely and thank you
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Cool…ohhh…give me your email. Or just comment something (a dot (.) or whatever) on any of my posts so I can get it from there. 🙂
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It is my username at gmail.
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No. Do not email with ANY women online. What the actual fuck?
This is how this BS *starts.* “Oh that would NEVER happen!”
Sure…
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Anything you say in private can be said here, Bac. You owe nothing to any woman on this earth, except your wife.
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I think you need to let go of your insecurities about initiating sex. You can’t put that all on your wife. She is very bulb in that area. After all that is how you betrayed her. If you want to heal your marriage then you need to look at it as a new relationship, and let the past go. That is what you are asking of your wife, so expect it of yourself as well. A sex life that is the responsibility of only one of the partners does not work.
As far as the nightgown goes, why not just have it under her pillow to put on on the morning…
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Well, that would be vulnerable not bulb…
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I wear a silk-lace chemise (goes to my lower hip) to bed – very simple, elegant, and comfortable – and have a cotton summer robe and a velvet winter robe to put on when I get up to let out the dog, make coffee, go to the bathroom, etc. This is a new thing, from about 6 months after D-day. I said it all cost too much. He took care to notice my needs, then put in his wants. I feel wanted, elegant, sexy, and cared for in them. He paid attention and put up a few hooks on the back of the door so it was easy to grab and slip into, at night… no matter how rough the day has been. He has always slept naked; I can’t. And in the winter, when it’s -10 degrees outside and 52 in the house? The Vermont Country Store nightgown goes on? Too effin’ bad and he just laughs. There are 42 buttons down the front – he told me so. That’s how many buttons it takes to have full access to my body. I love that he knows that. It took 12 YEARS, I know… but it shows that he thinks about me.
Or, I GUESS one could just complain that she buys bedclothes that are comfortable for her… you know, instead of finding a way to give her what she needs in a way that ALSO fulfills one’s own WANTS.
Pay ATTENTION to her, Bac.
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She has a number of nightgowns that are in the very comfortable category. We were just looking for something in between. I like the idea of the robes. She already has two of the cold weather ones, so it would just be a lighter one she would need. I will suggest it. Even though I want it to be attractive I still want her comfortable in it.
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We had NO luck anywhere but Macy’s. Victoria’s Secret was too sexified (great bras – horribly-unpractical nightwear) and casually browsing through Target showed items that were practical OR cheap/slutty-looking.
http://www1.macys.com/shop/womens-clothing/chemises/Size_normal,Sortby,Productsperpage/XL,ORIGINAL,100?id=55809
More like really long, sexy camisoles than nightgowns. And no boob-holder sections… just a straight run. Buy a size larger “in case it shrinks.” Manufacturers have to guesstimate the cup size and more frequently than not? Fail horrendously. lol
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Thanks. That is funny because we went to Macy’s and after looking for 30 min she had someone’s she wanted to try on but they told her no because they were closing. Really? It would have been 5 min and a sale and a happy customer.
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I understand about the sex and it won’t work with only one participant. I have been through that. As for the nightgown, I want her to get something that she likes and is comfortable in, but also doesn’t look like a burlap sack.
She wants to put more effort into her appearance and so she asked me to help her with this. We just could only find really sexy or really grandma looking. I think we are looking for some middle ground there somewhere. If I could find it I would buy it and give it to her.
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What hurts you about her reading your blog? Is it really about privacy? Or is it about you not being completely honest with her about your thoughts and emotions? What makes your blog no longer a safe place? What are you saying here that you aren’t saying to her? Are you only worried about her feelings or are you putting things out here that you aren’t saying to her?
Again, it all comes back to communication. I think you need to be brutally honest with yourself about why you don’t want her to read your blog. I understand a need for privacy. But if there are things you aren’t telling her – that needs to change. Even if you think you are protecting her. I promise you, lies hurt WAY more than the truth. And your wife seems to be asking for it. And right now, you’ve lost your right to privacy. Not forever. But for the time being. You need to be completely transparent. Completely open. Completely vulnerable. If you truly want to reconcile and work on a new marriage – these are non-negotiable. From both of you.
Could she have handled the other day better? Sure. She panicked. She saw you behaving a certain way and it was a trigger for her. She doesn’t trust you right now. She doesn’t trust her own emotions right now. So she went to where she felt she could get answers. I guarantee you, she is less happy about this situation than you. She hates feeling the need to look up her husband’s girlfriend online just to check on things. It sucks. Big time.
As far as the intimacy and connection – my husband and I are in a very similar boat. He felt rejected for years. Here’s the thing though – your rejection (and my husband’s) isn’t solely about your marriage. You had a shitty childhood. For real. What you’ve described is abuse and I can’t imagine what that’s like. And its shaped you. It would affect anyone. All things considered I’d say you rose above it pretty well. You seem to be a much more loving father than the example you were shown. However, you’ve been looking to your wife to make you feel good about yourself. And that’s unfair. And it sets both of you up to fail. I know. Because my husband and I have done the same dance for over 20 years. She is not responsible for how you feel. Any more than you’re responsible for her. Yes – you can treat each other with respect and love and compassion. Yes – you can do things for each other because you love each other. But at the end of the day – only you can make yourself happy. Only you can make yourself feel like enough. Its all within you. If you want to see more intimacy in your marriage – reach out to your wife. I know you’re afraid of being rejected. And you most likely will be from time to time. But you have to be the change you want to see. Either you are committed and gonna put yourself out there, or your marriage isn’t going to work. Your wife is grieving right now. She needs time to process all this. And then, one day, there will come a time when she needs to put herself out there too. Otherwise your marriage won’t work. It takes both of you giving 100%. Its not easy. Its scary. But its necessary. It takes time. Patience. Dedication. You have to chose it every day. Sometimes more than once.
I agree that if you find writing an outlet – then you need to continue. You have found a healthy outlet and need to keep it. Alcohol, affairs, avoidance, etc – all unhealthy ways of coping. Writing and getting it out is cathartic. Its why we’re all here. Just be sure that you are also communicating with your wife. It doesn’t do much good if you only put it on here and never work on it with her.
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Thanks for the way you handled your questions and comments. I am not really hurt by her reading it so much as she did it after she asked me about what was going on and then did not believe me. I understand that she just didn’t trust me and I am fine with it because I set that up.
I am sharing what is in this blog with her. The only thing that is not in here is some details that she does not want to know. She has asked not to know.
So why is it no longer a safe place? I can’t exactly tell you. I just feel like I have to be guarded. Maybe it is a response to something from long ago, who knows. I am willing to get over it and possible use the private feature someone else recommended. I am not trying to hide anything from her. i know that is the quickest way to failure.
As for you comment on intimacy and your struggle and finding everything from within, that was the best thing I have read all day. Thank you!
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I can see your point of view. I did ALOT of cyber stalking on my husband’s AP when I first found out. I also logged into some of his accounts to see if I could find more “evidence”. I also tried to hide it, then came clean. He wasn’t mad. Just stated that while I am demanding total transparency from him, I should be doing the same. At first I felt like he was just deflecting and hiding more. But I realized he had a point. It takes BOTH people to make it work.
As far as what you share, she leads that ship. You are correct in not sharing things that she hasn’t asked for. I’m a detail person. I want to know EVERYTHING. Then it haunts me to know. So I’ve learned to let go a little. I know another BS that only asked one question of her husband – if he loved his AP. That’s it. She wanted to know nothing else and is content that way. I have a crazy overactive imagination and over think the shit out of life. So I imagine all these scenarios (that are usually worse than the truth) when I don’t know the details. Anyways – I think you need to figure out why you don’t feel safe expressing yourself here anymore, knowing that your wife could read it. Is it the details she doesn’t want to know, yet you need to get out? If so, make that post private. I would just caution you to make sure you continue to communicate with her about where your head’s at. The more upfront you are and less you keep her guessing – the better. If you have a shitty day and just go to her and say, Wow my day sucked and here’s why – she won’t be left wondering and feeling like you’re covering stuff up. Be proactive. She’ll appreciate it.
Thanks for your last statement. We all have our own demons and shit to wade through. I try to be helpful where I can. I’ve been to enough therapy that I should be given an honorary degree like celebrities. It actually helps me to help others. Plus your story is so close to mine. At one point I actually wondered if you were my husband on here without me knowing it, and changing a few details. Seriously. Your history. How you feel. How your wife feels. All of it. Its spurred some good conversations with me and my husband. So, thanks for sharing.
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What are you more afraid of with her reading your blog – her getting hurt, or you feeling ashamed? You also offered to let her read it if she wants to. Why offer her that if you didn’t really mean it. Seems like you’re struggling between being open/honest with your wife vs protecting her/yourself from hurt, disappointment, shame. Secrecy is a powerful weapon – deceit, shame, guilt… they all thrive from secrecy and in the darkness. While being open and honest you cause much hurt and pain in the revealing, the difference is that once revealed, then you both have a chance to reconcile that for the future. You say you understand why your wife did what she did – why is that? Did she read your blog because she was insecure about you and the OW being in contact, or because she was worried about you and didn’t know what you were thinking as you’ve been very depressed? Is it really so bad that she can read your open and honest thoughts – at leas that takes away the doubt from her, and you have a chance to really discuss your feelings. Can you not consider the blog another outlet for communication with your wife, as well as an open forum for your true thoughts/emotions?
As for what your wife said about “love not being enough to make you stay”. Do you think she meant her love for you, or your love for her? From what you’ve wrote, it seems like you’re interpreting as her love for you. From what I understand here – HER love for you is what’s making HER stay, and trying to rebuild this marriage. I’m sure she’s not having great days herself either, so if she’s not happy, why is she staying? – it’s because she loves you – and the most important thing to her isn’t day to day happiness, but to walk through this journey of reconciliation with you and having the hope that one day, the relationship between both of you can be restored. Do you really think that right now she’s thinking ” he knows I love him so I don’t need to try” – I’m sure you know that she’s trying everyday now – to recover from your affair, but also to reconcile her past behaviour due to her depression towards you and to build a new future with you.
I think what she probably meant was that YOUR love for her isn’t enough to make YOU stay. Your love for her, and your kids. Perhaps its because recently you’ve highlighted many issues surrounding your morals, your background, your beliefs, and your needs – and she may be feeling that she would never be able to meet fully everything you’re wanting. And in the light of her past depression, which drove you to your recent affair – she may be feeling just as hopeless and discouraged as you. And so, is your love for them a good enough reason for you to stay?
Today’s day and age, I feel there’s a big shift in thought towards personal empowerment and personal happiness. And as such, phrases such as “only you can make yourself happy”, “if you’re not happy in the marriage, then leave”, “well, the most important thing is that you’re happy” exists. While i agree that people should be able to pursuit happiness, and live a happy life – I don’t think it’s something everyone “deserves”. But rather, what IS happiness, and what makes people happy? Why can some people find happiness amidst the most difficult and trying situations, while others are miserable when surround by opulence and love? When people talk about personal happiness, there seems to be a selfish component to it in justifying the entitlement to pursue happiness at the expense of responsibility, integrity, and other people’s happiness. Do you think that for the sake of one’s happiness, one can ignore everyone else’s because that is “their problem” and “only they can make themselves happy”? I honestly don’t. (This is purely philosophical at this point, and I’m not judging you at all).
What is happiness? What is joy? Part of it is having your needs fulfilled. Another part is also being to appreciate what you do have. And another is living in a way that you can be proud of yourself for staying true to your values and integrity. And finally, being selfless and bring joy to others can also makes yourself happy. So this brings it back to you, what will make you happy? What balance in each of the 4 components will make you happy? Only part 1 relies on others to fulfill, while parts 2-4 relies on yourself (i.e. something you control). And are you willing to let other people fulfill those needs, if they want to, or will you reject them out of pride/anger/bitterness/shame? And if your needs will not ALL be fully met, then will you be less happy, or will parts 2-4 make up for it. Do you think your all your needs can truly be fully met realistically? And if you decide to leave – then how much of parts 2-4 will affect your happiness?
One of the commenters above did say that you’re rebuilding a new marriage here. And so what does that new marriage look like? Your wife will need to heal from your infidelity and work on trusting you again. But in return, you will need to also heal from the bitterness that you’ve held on for the past 20 years against her and forgive her. It must have hurt from being rejected all these years. But as you’ve stated, it’s not because she doesn’t love you, but from a medical condition. And you promised to love her through health and sickness. That was her sickness. Are you going to hold that against her? She is now recovering, and working towards being a different wife than the one she had been for past 20 years. So is it your turn now to reject her to punish her/ let her see how it feels? Or will you drop the baggage, resentment, and start anew with her. And in turn, choose to hope rather holding onto hopelessness. Both you and her are on a journey to become better people, and better partners. Why not walk together, than to walk apart.
Sex is a huge trigger – but just like any other trigger – you need to decondition yourself to it. Your wife is trying to be a different person today – so can you allow yourself to be vulnerable again and initiate sex with her – not for your sake, but for her and the marriage? And if she no longer rejects you as frequently, then would that not dispel much of the bitterness and fear from past rejection? And the shame you feel after sex – you felt it caused your relationship problems and affair. But my questions is: was it the act of sex, or your DESIRE/NEED for sex? If not the act of sex, then why feel guilty for having sex with your wife. If you can look at it as a privilege for you and your wife to share to become intimate, rather than a definition of love or a sexual act of deviance, would that take away some of your guilt? To honour the act of sex, instead of seeing it as something you’re entitled to. Then perhaps, you won’t take rejection of sex as her not loving you or not wanting you – as sex does not define her love for you nor your love for her.
Take care and I hope days will look up for you.
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It’s assumed here by all the comments that you need to hang in there and make it work, but I think maybe you should just consider ending it and letting both of you move forward separately. There’s been a lot of damage done here, the fact that you’re even entertaining the idea of seeing the OW is concerning as is the way you hold the OW responsible for the damage done to your marriage, if I was your wife I wouldn’t trust you either. She is checking the OW’s facebook page to see what’s happening? This is bad. This may not be fixable.
Let me ask you if the situation was reversed how would you feel? Your wife had an affair for 9 months with a man she met online, she still thinks about him, sometimes they are in contact, now she wants to go this man’s house and retrieve an ‘item’ what would you do? How would you feel? How about some genuine empathy?
Is your wife staying with you because she loves you or because of the kids, or because she’s terrified of being alone, hasn’t worked for ages and won’t know how to pay the bills? You two are making each other absolutely miserable, it’s obvious she is right, you do want more and maybe you both want different things, it’s not a crime. Marriages fail, monogamy is hard, people have shitty childhoods, somtimes they also do good deeds, this is life. Give everyone a break and move forward in some direction somehow, but stop justifying and be honest. Basically I’m hearing ‘..I had an affair but I’m a good guy, really I am, really I am…” You are a good guy, you’re also a bad guy, you’re a human. Either really own what you did, (don’t blame other people – your bad upbringing, the OW enticing you, your wife rejecting you, everyone else) and really love your wife (for who she is, not what she’s wearing, or how heavy she is) accept that and move on with genuine trust, love how about some joy even – or get out and let everyone start over.
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You have written a lot here I feel regarding your wife and her feelings towards you. Seems that you have lost her trust which is why she snooped on you. I have not read your entire blog yet so I’m not sure if she is the type of person who over reacts or she just needs more time to get over your affair. Me personally, I have no privacy. Its pretty much nonexistent. My husband goes through EVERY single thing I have. And I cannot say no. So I’m limited in terms of being myself at home. As for the dressing up, did she enjoy dressing up before or she was she always this way ?
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She used to take a lot of pride in her appearance but she slowly stopped caring. I don’t expect her to dress up, just put a little effort in to how she looks. She is the one who pointed this out so it isn’t like I said you have to dress up for me. I also told her that I get some days are just days you go with sweats and a t-shirt and that’s okay. Sometimes I prefer that, just not everyday.
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Okay. I have a better understanding now. For me it’s the opposite, my husband does not want me to dress up let’s say for work as an example. He will make some stupid comment, like you’re going on a date at work ? Then it’s worst if I put on makeup, hair, etc. So I try to look like a bum when he’s here. Yet I get scolded when I wear sweats. Its like everything I do is wrong. Nothing will ever please him. So why do I even try ? But I think it’s great you guys are talking about it. My communication with my husband is just….troublesome…
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“I don’t expect her to dress up, just put a little effort in to how she looks. She is the one who pointed this out so it isn’t like I said you have to dress up for me.”
For me, not dressing with care was a manifestation of my deep-rooted feeling that I wasn’t worth the effort. I was feeling that way already but the affair really clinched it. It metasticized instead of me being soft and worried about the idea, as I had been… the affair was confirmation that I really WASN’T worth it. I still struggle with this. My husband had to launch me into it… saying he’d buy me things he thought were beautiful (but wouldn’t fit me or look right on me, for one reason or another) if I wouldn’t do it. It drew me in… I care MORE about my appearance than I had been but I’m still not quite to where I’d go out and do it on my own. That’s too much for me right now.
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I think that was where she was at when her depression was at its worst. She didn’t think it mattered or that she mattered so why try.
I don’t want to get put in the position of her not liking or feeling comfortable in what I buy her so I take her with me. Plus it is time together.
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Yes! 🙂 Husband and I have a lot of mini-dates now. I just wanted to point out that I’m still having difficulty with this – even after 8 months of us getting me a whole new wardrobe, favorite piece by piece – and she may be too. I still say no to things I like and put things back because I don’t feel like I’m worth it – the money or the fuss.
“Pixie pants” at Old Navy, well-fitting cardigans, low wedge heels, and a nice haircut/highlight with Morrocan oil to use at home (to finish wet hair, since the idea of me using a blowdryer daily is hilariously unrealistic), and just putting on mascara, lipstick, and pretty earrings every day. That’s what got me out of the deepest “funk” about my appearance. I looked sassy and it made me feel better overall… and it started showing in the house and in my cooking again too. I was flirtacious again. I was getting my pride back.
But it’s still hard some days and doing all that stuff – having it all THERE – is what I NEED to do to catch myself from falling back in.
I hope your wife finds that process fulfilling in all the ways she needs… I just wanted to point out that it takes time to feel like you ARE that person and not a fraud. And that you’ll need to bolster that… brag on her, to her and to others, and show her how much you love the her she is, like that. To see her bloom from within herself so much that it shows on the outside. That you love her.
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You are right on in this post. A woman who has been hit by infidelity has a huge mountain to climb to feel good about herself. To feel she is worthy as a human , to feel she has self worth and nothing, not even infidelity can change that. Self worth we are born with and should never change until the day we die. We attach the wrong things to self worth. I did. My marriage was attached to my self worth. It is a hard battle and a daily struggle but as time goes on small steps are taken to restore it. It takes time and it needs to come from within. You need to let her see that she is really worth the hard road to reconciliation. I read somewhere ( too many books and articles read to remember which author) but in the process of re establishing an intimate sexual relationship after infidelity it is the adulterer that should make the sexual advances. No matter if they were rejected before, take the risk and be vulnerable and see where it takes you. Your wife will soon start to feel desirable which will make her feel happier and less likely to reject your advances and you in turn will be less likely to be rejected. It may be a slow process but if you don’t make advances to her what is that telling her? That she is not desirable?
I am sorry you feel ill after sex but you need to fix that yourself and not put the burden out there. Why do you let your powerful mind take such control? You need to control that. You need to tell your mind who is he boss and you need to make the experience of sex for both yourself and your wife the most intimate and desirable thing you do. You can do it. Change your thinking and you change your mind.
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Thanks. I can see your point in needing to take a chance and make the advances. Scary though, but probably worth it.
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